My 1rst Attempt at Something Not Metal

[Battlefrost]

This is one of my first attempts at really trying to record a singer/songwriter type of acoustic artist. I mostly just do metal bands, so this is quite different for me.

Please listen to the 1 minute sample of this rough recording. I say rough because I have not done anything to it, no EQ, no compression, nothing. These tracks are untouched from how they were recorded.

To me, it sounds dull, like a blanket is covering the speakers. Please give me honest observations about what you think.

Here is how it was done...

1 spot mic (Behringer B5) at about 3 or 4 inches from the 12th fret. This mic ran into a Presonus Eureka Preamp and into a Fireface 800 input.

2 room mics (Behringer B5's). These mics were a spaced stero pair about 6ft back from the player/guitar. These ran straight into the built in mic pres on the Fireface 800. These were paned hard left and right (that was the only thing I did to the raw tracks).

1 DI track taken from the acoustic guitar output from the pick-ups. This singal was sent to a Radial J48 active DI box and then into an input on the Fireface 800. This DI track was mixed lower in level than the mics were, but it is in there.

The vocals were tracked with a Shure KSM44 with the cardiod pattern selected along with the first roll-off option. This signal ran into the Presonus Eureka with about 3db of gain reduction performed bu the built in channel compressor. The singer stood about 4 inches back behind a pop filter.

The sample is here (http://www.battlefrost.com/shadowboxing.wav).

Thank you for your input.

-Charles

[Sandyrb]

Hey Charles.

This is one of my first attempts at really trying to record a singer/songwriter type of acoustic artist. [...] Please listen to the 1 minute sample of this rough recording.

I like it! I don't really see that there's much wrong with it at all. You say that it sounds a bit dull but on the other hand not every recording needs to be bristling with the itchy crispness of too much top end. :)

I also recognise that this is, as you put it, a rough recording and the one thing I would change is just to level the voice and guitar out a bit more; I find the voice is too prominent and I'd like the guitar to be a bit more "expansive". But I know you're going to get to that later.

My intense dislike of the "evil B-word" (Behringer) notwithstanding, this track is clear, present, tasteful and, in my opinion, well recorded. Could it be better? Well, given more expenditure on gear probably... There is a little background noise which I'm going to put down to your pres. But I think in the "I work with what I've got" stakes it performs really well. Great job mate! :)

Cheers,

[Mixwell]

Not so sure I hear anything terribly awful or "dull" [as I can define it] on my Mac Laptop. Actually sounds pretty good, though; I think trying to get a more defined recording with less microphones, makes sense, Certainly; Ambience microphones can be really cool, but maybe for this material closer mono miked with the KSM44, would be a good call. Move the microphone around the guitar with him playing, while you listen on headphones. This way, you can target the most inviting response from the instrument.

Why even bother with the DI?

Maybe you are hearing some minor but interesting time related issues because of the DI mixed in with the 3-mike acoustic space????? Just speculating. It doesn't sound bad here. Phase related issues can certainly "dull" an instrument. I personally cannot stand the "open mic night" acoustic sound, [I think its "plasticy" and brash sounding] so perhaps trying to get a more organic, and more direct sound from the instrument to promote more depth in the recording will be worth attempting.

[pauly]

Why even bother with the DI?



i agree, i'm not too fond of a di on guitars. i think the clip sounds very good though. the material is good, that always helps and his voice nice too.

[pauly]

some may disagree with this but i after another listen i would have compressed the guitar just a little more.

not that this has anything to do with your situation but i generally run acoustics through my distressor's 6:1, attack 2, release 5 and i'll adjust the threshhold so i average 5 or 6 db of reduction. the better the guitarist generally i will back that off a little but not always. depending on the situation these things always change but thats where i start.

[Dan]

My intense dislike of the "evil B-word" (Behringer) notwithstanding, this track is clear, present, tasteful and, in my opinion, well recorded. Could it be better? Well, given more expenditure on gear probably... There is a little background noise which I'm going to put down to your pres. But I think in the "I work with what I've got" stakes it performs really well. Great job mate!

Ditto. I didn't hear dullness either. What I did hear was that the guitar's low notes were a bit on the boomy side (which may lead you to think that is sounds dull). If your close mic was really only 3-4" from the guitar (about the length of a business card), it could be your positioning. I'd try backing it up a smidge.



-Dan.

[Halfway Competent]

This is one of my first attempts at really trying to record a singer/songwriter type of acoustic artist. I mostly just do metal bands, so this is quite different for me.

Please listen to the 1 minute sample of this rough recording. I say rough because I have not done anything to it, no EQ, no compression, nothing. These tracks are untouched from how they were recorded.

To me, it sounds dull, like a blanket is covering the speakers. Please give me honest observations about what you think.

Here is how it was done...

1 spot mic (Behringer B5) at about 3 or 4 inches from the 12th fret. This mic ran into a Presonus Eureka Preamp and into a Fireface 800 input.

2 room mics (Behringer B5's). These mics were a spaced stero pair about 6ft back from the player/guitar. These ran straight into the built in mic pres on the Fireface 800. These were paned hard left and right (that was the only thing I did to the raw tracks).

1 DI track taken from the acoustic guitar output from the pick-ups. This singal was sent to a Radial J48 active DI box and then into an input on the Fireface 800. This DI track was mixed lower in level than the mics were, but it is in there.

The vocals were tracked with a Shure KSM44 with the cardiod pattern selected along with the first roll-off option. This signal ran into the Presonus Eureka with about 3db of gain reduction performed bu the built in channel compressor. The singer stood about 4 inches back behind a pop filter.

The sample is here (http://www.battlefrost.com/shadowboxing.wav).

Thank you for your input.

-Charles

I'm digging it! The guitar actually has a pretty nice tone to it. At first I was thinking it was a little scooped in the mid, but that's a good thing with the mid-centric vocal.

Try this: Add a very subtle, and very short (1 sec decay or less) room 'verb to the vocal. High-cut the 'verb around 3k. I do this to add "fullness" to vocals sometimes... If you can hear it as reverb, it's too much.

The guitar sounds good... For the most part the pickup/DI was unobtrusive, but I did hear a couple notes with that signature direct acoustic sound. :) Try muting (or reducing) the D.I. track and see what you think. I also like subtle reverbs on acoustic guitar, but with your room mics providing a nice bit of "space" I don't think it's necessary here.

When you say it sounds dull, are you trying to get a sound such as that on "Collide" by Howie Day? You can do that by over-compressing and cranking the high EQ, but I don't think that sound would be appropriate for a breathy, intimate song such as this. Listen to "Speak Your Heart" by Lizz Wright... Similar kind of sound. Acoustic and vocals sound largely unvarnished, except for some comp on each.

I'll echo the suggestion of a little comp on the guitar and bringing it up a bit relative to the vocal. I dont' think the vocal needs any more comp.

Good work!

[Battlefrost]

Thank you very much everyone, this is certainly not what I expected to hear. I was expecting to hear a list of things I did wrong.

Sandy, that background sound is actually my computer fan...ha ha ha. I will put the computer in another room when we record the next tracks, or install some quieter fans or something. It almost sounds like a tape hiss, but not quite. I certainly don't want that showing up in the next tracks.

Also, I too am not a fan of the "B" word equipment, but thats what we had laying around in the order of small diaphram condencers.

I live in San Diego, CA and there is pretty much nothing here as far as equipment rentals. There is a nice place in Los Angelas called "Audio Rents". I may just drive up the road and pick up some 184's or something for some of the future tracks.

This particular project is my partners idea. We are recording about 20 different artists of this singer/songwriter/acoustic type of genre for a compilation. He is getting us a cut of the publishing rights and other related stuff or something.

Anyway, that clip was from the first artist wich I tracked last week. I don't think we will do any actual mixing for a few weeks yet, maybe after we have tracked several more artists.

Anyway, thank you all for your comments and suggestions, they are always most welcome. I am always learning, especially when it comes to this style.

-Charles

[burnthair donethat]

not bad sounding to me at all. it's on the hissy side though that might, as said above, due to weak links in the signal chain.

the typical brightness associated with the acoustic guitar could be enhanced by angling the right hand a bit so that a little nail gets in with the fleshy part of the fingers but an adjustment like that could hamper the singer by making too conscious of what he's doing and hence pulling the plug on any vibe that he was working towards. that said, i do like the vibe.

peace,

bh